Election 2012: Debate #3 – Foreign Policy

 Billed as a foreign policy debate, this is the chart for Presidential Debate #3 which is scheduled to take place on October 22, 2012 at 9 p.m. (EDT) at Florida's Lynn University

The third (and last) 2012 Presidential Debate is scheduled for Monday, October 22nd at 9 p.m. (EDT) at Lynn University in Boca Raton, Florida.

And the chart? It’s above. And its 9th house Moon in Aquarius is slap-dab on the money.

Foreign money? Maybe. The 9th house is, after all the house of all things ‘foreign.’ And Aquarius is the sign of economics and income.

But in a national chart (or discussion), Aquarius is more the sign of social systems which in the 9th suggests things like foreign students and foreign workers. International trade. Students getting jobs when they graduate with higher degrees. The cost of education and whether a nation should-or-shouldn’t support those educational institutions, particularly as that concerns foreign-born or immigrant students.

Given that Aquarius is also the sign of ‘sticking with the system or rebelling against (aka changing) it’ and how you go about it, the cost of changing or not changing how America functions is bound to come up. It may be an undercurrent, it may be front and center, but it will be there – as will be the spoken or unspoken issue of foreign cultures, religious or state sponsored fanaticism. Religion is a 9th house subject. Fanaticism is Aquarian – as again, so is a ‘social state’ which in combination with the 9th house is easily translated as ‘nations who see things differently than the United States does.’

But there’s a whole other issue which is just as potent as this 9th house Moon. That’s the fact that this chart has 9 Gemini rising and 9 Sagittarius thus at the Descendant. Those two degrees are currently inhabited by Royal Stars Aldebaran (at the Gemini Ascendant) and Antares (at the Sagittarian Descendant).

This is a tricky sort of thing which will have the candidates debating who’s acting (Ascendant) with integrity and who’s obsessed (Antares) with what others do, how they do it, what they don’t do (the way you do, maybe) and what people think of you.

Many an American President has said what they wanted to say, regardless of what others
thought of it.  But when it comes to HOW things have been said,few can hold a candle to
Abraham Lincoln, a man who said more in fewer words while touching more hearts than perhaps
any other President throughout United States history. I'm the first person to say that reading

history can be incredibly dull. But when I sat down to read a collection of Lincoln's writings and
speeches, I came away inspired, gratified and far more aware of history as something current,
not something which exists only in the past.

Lincoln Memorial in Washington, D.C.

(photo credit: Erich Robert Joli Weber, June 2012)

On one hand, this lays out a playing field which tests the sheer communicating skills of both candidates. How much of what we will see and hear will be about policy? How much will reveal the nature of each man? How much will each of them play to the audience?

The ruler of the Aldebaran/Ascendant (the integrity of/in what you do) is framed here in theoretical Gemini terms – which may bring out a bit of the preacher in both men. But the ruler of that Gemini is at 23 Scorpio in the 6th house of necessity and conjunct the North Node.

This brings a focus to what responsibility does a government have versus what responsibilities do people have for their own lives. With Mercury and the North Node in 3rd decanate degrees (degrees between 20 and 29 of a given sign) this signals a response which will definitely come after the debate on this topic, whether it gets discussed or not.

And the signs involved here - on the 6th house cusp and its polarity 12th house cusp – because those are Scorpio (on 6) and Pisces on the cusp of the 12th, plainly that which has so far been summarized as ‘the level playing field’ underlies this whole discussion.

With Sedna, the South Node and Algol in the 12th (all in Taurus) we’re likely to hear the ‘out of touch’ conversational touchstone being evoked. Heck, one or both of the candidates may verbally throw it at the other guy!

But the thing to watch out for is probably denoted by  Black Moon Lilith at 4 Gemini conjuncting (take a deep breath) Hybris…arrogance…conjuncting Aldebaran (integrity) at the Ascendant.

This becomes sort of a conversational “he who sounds most arrogant loses” signal. And since the Gemini Ascendant leads through Mercury in Scorpio to (Scorpio’s two rulers) Mars in the 7th house and Pluto in the 8th house, that’s were the emotional cord doth lead.

About the only question is whether that cord is long enough for either candidate to trip over…or hang themselves with.

Mars is not strong in the 7th house. Conjunct defender of the household Juno, this would be a conversation about Leadership. Throw in Hidalgo (manners, protocol) and we have a conversation about the many (Sagittarius) things a national leader (Juno) has to deal with with and manage through governmental channels (Hidalgo) before they go pronouncing their opinions or ‘facts’ not yet in evidence.

This last is very Mars in Sagittarius. Sagittarius is a sign known for ‘pronouncements’ (and rhetoric, and dictates) which may have a place in national leadership but probably isn’t the default position for any successful  President.

As for Pluto, Pluto in the 8th in Capricorn suggests two topics at least: the national debt and war. With Pluto still working over the ‘many tangled threads’ symbol we know as Facies, the combination of Mars and Pluto sounds a bit like ‘haste makes waste’ which on the world/national/governmental/military stage could be seriously deadly.

A yellow-crowned Night Heron (Nycticorax violaceus) enjoys the beach in Boca Raton. It's not likely

any of them will attend the Presidential Debate, but you never know!

(Ianare Sevi, June 2009)

One more item well worth noting here before turning to individual charts…Vesta is going retrograde on the very date of this debate: October 22nd. Which means Vesta is going on station as of the 20th - which is why this post is hitting the digital airwaves now.

You know...it's that old 'station allowance' thing. Two days (maybe a bit more) before and the same after the date of station? That means Vesta's station effects begin on the 20th and run through the 24th.

We also know that Vesta is doing its ‘turnabout’ at 25 Gemini. And since 25 is a 3rd decanate degree, we know that other people are going to get input and say on the  standard Vesta question of ‘promises.’

But to equate Vesta just with the word 'promises' is to short-change the subject. Yes, Vesta does sometimes surface in someone getting all miffed because ’you promised that…’

So this would not be the moment to go and break your word. Not even for cutting corners on your word!

Although...well, this might be the moment for thinking over corner cutting you've already done. Or how you can explain that promise you didn't mean to break but...

You know, that stuff.

So Vesta is promises, plain and simple. but Vesta is also all about what it takes to keep a promise. All those comments you make to yourself about what you need to do or get done. All the feelings and working out of schedules to meet that schedule.

With Vesta in Gemini, and with Gemini being ruled by Mercury, that does leads us right back to that Mars and Pluto as rulers of Scorpio conversation.

But it also indicates a choice. And that combination of 'promise' plus 'choice' is both the choosing to promise and the hard-nosed concept that nine times out of ten when we do break a promise (if we do) we choose to do so knowing what we're doing.

Oh, what a nuance to add to a political debate!

But that Mercury quality...considering that the Mercury of the debate chart is in the 6th house that points to one's 'functionaries.' And when it comes to a President or a presidential candidate, there are functionaries a-plenty.

Let's see...foreign affairs...functionaries...matters to be debated...one could guess we will hear more about recent tragic doings in the Middle East.

 Who will spend the next four years living here?

The White House (south side) in Washington, DC

(photo credit Cezary p, July 2008)

Back to the 6th house. The 6th house of a national chart is, among other things its military, health care and the  civil service - which in the case of the United States includes Congress.

Oh, gosh oh golly gee...such things could get said! All of the above (health care, the military, Congress) are hot-button subjects. But with the Moon and Mercury in square by house? Part one: whoever talks about any of these topics had better know their facts. Part two, they had best have both a problem and solution on tap, lest they look petulant. Because Mercury rules that Ascedant-conjunct-Aldebaran, their statements must reek of integrity...the 'winning' attitude with this combo will be the guy who knows how to pose their statements as implied questions - not accusations.

And no matter the format, things may get feisty! Even a touch testy. Scorpio and Aquarius are both fixed signs: feelings and convictions will be there under the skin. With the Moon in Aquarius, taking the high road is a good idea, though getting haughty or arrogant (which tend to be the negative side of the Scorpio Moon) is not a good idea. Whatever sign the Moon is in, that spells out (among other things) what qualities the audience is going to be sensitive to. With an Aquarian Moon, care is advised...but evasion isn't. The job of Aquarius is to take the job on: to show what you can do and prove you deserve approval.

One other note to this square-by-sign: treating people like numbers...or using difficulties, challenges or tragedies merely for a political goad isn't going to wash. Making the point while showing that they know real people are involved (Americans or otherwise) is important to both candidates. The 'business' of war is about people, not commerce or personal power. Anyone who gets near those negatives is going to blow themselves out of the water (pardon the pun!).

Another point about this chart: it contains a Ceres-Saturn-Neptune grand trine. Among other things, one can bet there are many non-Americans listening to this debate. It's also more likely than usual that something will get said which is particularly telling...or maybe just entirely memorable.

Debates are funny that way. Get people talking and even the most schooled of politicians will sometimes go and say the gob-stopping-est things!

For Governor Romney on a personal basis, that his native Pluto (at 22 Leo) exactly opposite the Moon of this debate puts him on a tightrope between his desire to get people to think his way and an inborn instinct to be the private sort of person his personality…or his Mormonism (or maybe both) have created him to be.

Governor Mitt Romney

March 12, 1947 - 9:51 a.m. - Detroit, MI

That Governor Romney’s personal Asc-Dsc line lies at 1 Gemini/1 Sagittarius suggests he will go into this debate feeling somewhat at home. With his native Ascendant conjunct the debate’s Black Moon Lilith (at 4 Gemini)…is that a good idea? The Black Moon is always some sort of ‘externalized’ denial – as opposed to asteroid Lilith, which is about our internal issues with emotional denial. But on the outside? This is either Romney wanting to deny something that he’s done or said, wanting to deny some portion of society something, or being denied a (Gemini) hearing no matter what he does.

Romney’s Gemini Ascendant is ruled by his Pisces Mercury. This is an emotional Mercury which can charm or inspire, but which isn’t always strong. In square to Romney’s natal Uranus in the 1st house, this also the very description of the fact that Romney appears to contradict himself (or change positions on the proverbial dime) …but also why: a Gemini Uranus in the 1st ruled by a Pisces Mercury in the 11th is ‘built’ to get what is wanted in the moment. It’s not the same as lying; with both planets in emotional degrees what underpins this tendency is a genuine desire to be liked and – at some level – an insecurity with/about Self.

As for President Obama, his Ascendant is 10 Aquarius and his Descendant is 10 Leo (the later ruled by a 12 Leo Sun which makes him very adept at being in front of the public). With his Ascendant one degree off the debate’s 11 Aquarius Moon, he could be overly professorial again. Then again, he could come off as divisive.

President Barack Obama

August 4, 1961 - 7:24 p.m. - Honolulu, HI

With his natal Moon at 3 Gemini, he too has Black Moon Lilith problems, though since Obama’s Moon is natively well placed (particularly for a President) in the 4th house, he may use this Moon/Lilith dynamic to emphasize what people don’t have but need if they’re going to get ahead. Or if the US is going to be built (modernized?) to compete on the international stage.

(Mitt Romney’s Moon being intercepted in the 6th house has helped make him rich via Bain Capital, but it isn’t as likely to connect to everyday people. While streamlining companies has its pluses, right now all people are going to hear is ‘you’re getting wealthy by firing people’ and that’s not a big vote-getter!)

The Nodal axis in Obama’s chart runs from 27 Aquarius (South Node) to 27 Leo (North Node) – and in that aligns rather well with the ‘where this is going’ Midheaven-Nadir of the debate chart. With his Uranus conjunct his North Node he may get distracted and off conversation and if he does, that will hurt him. Obama’s tendency to be a ‘big picture’ thinker isn’t exactly compatible with people wanting him to talk to them.

We’ll have to see if he remembers.

Whatever happens and however the President and Governor Romney go about saying whatever they’re going to say, it’s pretty sure everyone out here in audience-land will remember what gets said.

And then…finally!…the nation will go to the polls and all the votes will get counted.

WHOEVER YOUR CANDIDATE IS,

ELECTION DAY IS NOVEMBER 6TH!

BE SURE TO VOTE!

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